Wednesday, 1 September 2010

The antismoking smokers.

I know there are smokers who consider Electrofag as 'a bit girlie' and not real smoking. There are also Electrosmokers who act like those born-again non-smokers of old, those who, having kicked a 60-a-day habit, then demand that nobody ever smoke within a five mile exclusion zone because they really, really hate it.

And that's why ASH and their ilk currently have the upper hand.

I smoke both Electrofag and real tobacco. I'm waiting for some more Electrofags too, because the two I have are very different, and neither is the same as tobacco. So I've ordered samples of a few more.

Is the difference between Electrofags bad? I think not. I have friends who smoke readymades. I smoke rollups. I find the readymades a little acrid for my taste although having tried them in the past, I appreciate that there are huge differences between brands. As there are with rollups - I don't like Drum, I'm happy with Golden Virginia but if I can get it, I prefer Amber Leaf or Gold Leaf.

So if all Electrofags were the same, they'd fail. It would be as if all cigarettes were Marlboro and the only tobacco available was Drum. The fact they are all different is a good thing.

I like a cigar now and then. Usually at Christmas and on National No Smoking Day. For me, it's Henri Winterman's or King Edward. None of that Hamlet stuff. To smoke it or not to smoke it, that's the question. The answer is 'no, get a good one instead'. For others, Hamlet would be the best.

It's all personal preference. Non-drinkers will try a taste of a cheap and nasty blend of whisky, of the kind usually to be found in pubs as 'house whisky', and say 'how can you drink that stuff?' I don't. It's horrible. I drink a different kind of whisky. I would rather drink less of the good stuff than more of the drain cleaner.

As the non-drinker cannot understand the differences in whiskies, so a non-smoker cannot understand the differences in tobacco brands. Extending that, a non-Electrosmoker can't understand the differences in Electrofags. They try one, think 'yeuk' and that's it.

Okay, trying a lot of different Electrofags can be expensive (it wouldn't be if the buggers didn't all have different battery fittings) although starter kits are appearing more and more. One battery, a USB charger and a couple of cartridges can sell in the £10-20 range. Sounds expensive, but that doesn't get a lot of tobacco at UK prices. In whisky terms it's only halfway to a bottle of Lagavulin and well below a bottle of Glenmorangie. It's not really risking much more than trying a different brand of cigarettes. It's risking far less than trying a different brand of single-malt whisky.

When smokers were allowed in pubs, we could test new whiskies by buying one glass. The odd thing about Electrofag is that it only seems to be available by post. Unlike tobacconists, there are no shops (that I've seen) even though unlike tobacconists, it would still be perfectly legal to try the product on the premises. Cartridges loaded with enough for a few test puffs, disposed of after one use, would allow for a wider range of products to be tested and you never know, you might find one you like.

Incidentally, antismokers, how many of you frequent tobacconists? Not the Evil Weed counter at the supermarket but the specialist shops that sell only tobacco and smoking gear and nothing else?

How many non-smokers visit? Since smokers go into such shops looking for tips and advice as well as tobacco, how many non-smokers are likely to be employed in there?

Come on, antismokers. Explain why smoking is banned in a premises that is staffed and visited by smokers and nobody else? While you're at it, justify the legal denial of a smoking room in a cigarette factory.

While you're thinking about that one, I'll continue. Take your time, seventy-third hand smoke (reading about it) won't kick in for an hour or so yet and you'll live at least four hours after that.

Electrofag has had more use than anticipated this summer because the weather has been dreadful. Even so, I have not given up tobacco because Electrofag isn't the same. I don't regard Electrofag as inferior to smoking. It's just different. Like those cigars which I smoke rarely and pipes which I once smoked but don't at the moment. It's a different form of smoking.

It is, to me, still smoking. Smoking in the digital age. Battery powered and flameless. It has its ancillary enjoyments too, as when some pompous ass declares 'you can't smoke that in here' and you drop what appears to be a lit cigarette into your shirt pocket. You can pretend to light one of these things using a keyring-sized LED torch for greater effect. That's even more fun if you have an Electrofag that lights up blue. Watch them wonder what you're smoking!

As to the actual electrosmoking, I still find the Njoy better for general-purpose smoking but the Titan has the weirdness factor. As I said, I've ordered samples of more because they come in so many variations. I'll comment on them when they arrive. I only go for ones that are cigarette sized and shaped. Some of the variants look too, well, medical for my tastes.

Yes, the Electrofag is fun but it has not entirely replaced real tobacco because it is not the same. It is enjoyable but in a different way, just as whisky is enjoyable in a different way to beer, or lamb is enjoyable in a different way to chicken.

The self-imposed apartheid between smokers and electrosmokers doesn't seem to happen anywhere else. Some people don't like lamb, but I've never heard them vehemently denounce those who do. I've never heard them say 'Chicken is the only Proper Meat and if you eat lamb, you're letting the side down'. When the Meat Control cranks up alongside tobacco, booze and salt, will we hear Jews and Muslims saying 'We don't like pork so meat must be banned'? No, they are smart enough to realise that it won't just be pork in the sights. Will they do a CAMRA and cry 'Don't ban us, ban them'? I seriously doubt it.

So when Meat Control comes along, it will find life difficult because all meat-eaters, whatever their preferences, will stick together. Booze Control is just as easy as Tobacco Control because it is really, really easy to set CAMRA against those who like fizzy cold beer from an electric pump. It is easy to set the gin and tonic types against the park bench Red Stripe drinkers. It is easy to set the wine buffs against the vodka drinkers.

They are all drinkers. They will all be affected by the Shenkerite Puritans but it is easy to pretend to each of them that it's the other groups that are the problem. So they split, fight amongst themselves and Shenker sneaks in and steals all their booze. He has the support of every group against the other groups. Each group thinks they will be spared. None will.

The same thing is happening with smoking. There are 'vapers' who consider tobacco users as evil and there are smokers who consider vapers as cop-outs. There are cigar smokers who think cigarettes are disgusting and pipe smokers who regard other forms of smoking as inferior. There are readymade smokers who think rollie smokers are cheapskates and there are rollie smokers who think readymades are for the lazy.

Differential taxation rates on cigarettes, cigars and pipe tobacco have nothing to do with 'relative harm' and everything to do with 'divide and rule'. They are designed to make one group feel superior to another and to make one group in particular aggrieved at having to pay more tax than the others.

Then there is the attack on Electrofag, which is nothing more than vitamin B3 in steam yet is portrayed as more deadly than smoking. There are smokers who support such an attack on the basis that 'We're banned, why shouldn't they be too?' That is the wrong attitude. Switch it around to 'They're allowed, why aren't we?' and you're getting somewhere.

As long as smokers of one product are the enemies of smokers of another product, we are split and easily controlled. None will be spared. No, vapers, not even you. ASH find it useful to let you advertise 'the evils of smoking' for now, but when your usefulness has reached its limits, you're going the same way as the rest of us. Don't be fooled by sweet words and promises. This has nothing to do with health. It's not the smoke they hate, it's the enjoyment.

Also, vapers, be careful of trashing the tobacco industry. Where do you think the nicotine comes from for Electrofag? For that matter, where do you think the nicotine comes from for those patches and gum? You must have noticed the tobacco industry aren't saying much lately. Whether they sell the stuff to tobacconists or pharmacists, they make money either way. Yes, ASH, by promoting the patches and gum you are supporting the tobacco industry. By constantly banging on about smoking you are selling their tobacco and also the extracted nicotine for the patches that don't work and send smokers back to tobacco. Oh, the tobacco industry isn't complaining because they are on a winner, thanks to ASH.

As long as we are split into different types of smokers and are at war with each other, the Dreadful Arnott laughs. Every time a vaper harps on about how horrible smokers are, the Dreadful Arnott giggles. Every time a smoker derides vapers, the Dreadful Arnott hugs herself (well, nobody else will).

Look, we can fight about who has the best way of smoking another time. For now, we are all under attack from one common enemy who wants all of us gone. All of us. No exceptions.

Just sit back, light up (or power up depending on your preference) and think about the absurdity of being an antismoking smoker.

We are all smokers. The differences are cosmetic. Fighting on the basis of those differences is as ridiculous as fighting over the colour of our skins.

So can we stop it, at least until we've disposed of our common enemy? They are in high places and they are looking down on our petty squabbles and laughing at us, you know.

And we are all paying the taxes that fund their cruel sports.


UPDATE: As if to prove the point...

26 comments:

Lysistrata said...

Yes. Just yes.

About an hour ago I posted a comment related to this on F2C.
(towards the end of what was really a rant about their being fucked by UKIP et al and not invited to a party..)

http://www.freedom2choose.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=4425&p=129095#p129095

[crap at this interweb thingie please make your own link no can do too drunk]

Frank Davis said...

I don't mind the taste of readymades. My problem with them is that they burn down so quickly. They're gone in less than 5 minutes.

I sat by the river this afternoon for an hour with my pint, and smoked 5 rollups. And that was more or less chain-smoking too. So each rollup lasted 12 minutes. And I usually only smoke 4 roll-ups an hour, which is 15 minutes each.

Every time I light up a readymade, I'm astonished how quickly they're gone.

Leg-iron said...

Readymades keep burning when you set them down Rollups don't. Readymades also seem very dry.

I think they add something to keep them burning when you're not smoking, just to waste them.

Anonymous said...

Do they add saltpeter to keep them burning? Its a distant memory.
I've got a Njoy and I'm impressed, although only indoors for some reason, they seem weaker outside.
With a pint its rollups, there is simply no other option.

Angry Exile said...

When I smoked I used to find Drum was a bit like Guinness. Better if bought in Holland than the local Tesco. I don't know if it's true but someone told me that the old brand, Duma I think it was, was an inferior grade baccy, so I always tried to get an order for some Drum in with anyone going to Holland or Belgium rather than buy Duma in Britain. Possibly psychological but I felt I made better rollies with Drum too - beautiful creaseless cylinders, some of them.* Anyhow, the point is I wonder if they simply rebranded Duma as Drum and carried on as before, so Dutch Drum was good and English Drum was mediocre. Possible?


* Weird side point, this: after all this time as a non-smoker the only thing I still miss about smoking is the act of hand rolling a cigarette. If I was somewhere I couldn't smoke making cigarettes was as therapeutic as smoking them. Or maybe I'm just strange.

tsange said...

If you like to try many types of electrofags, the easiest way is to get a mod (a tube or box holding a big battery) with adapters for several types of atomizers.
And before trying all >100 e-liquids available, best is to have a look in a vapers forum to get a general idea about the differences.

PT Barnum said...

Much has made in the last 24 hours about Blair's self-confessed alcohol dependency when he was our Messiah. To me, this can only represent yet one more way of sticking the boot into people who enjoy a tipple to take the edge off. And I can't drink so I ought to be screeching 'See? He ran the country through a haze of booze! Ban it now!' But I'm not. I'm just mildly envious of those who can.

@ Angry Exile
The only occasion I have cause to feel a little pumped up with pride is when someone looks at the pre-rolled rollies in my tin and asks 'Do you use a machine?' No, never do :)

PT Barnum said...

Woo hoo! New on the market this week - fried beer! Invented by a Texan.

Anonymous said...

Simon Chapman on RIP cigarettes.

"It is questionable whether technology and legislation are needed to solve the problem.

As smokers know, cigars, pipe tobacco and hand-rolled cigarettes tend to go out on their own.

That's because regular cigarettes contain burning agents to keep them lit.

"The elimination of burning agents in cigarette paper would be a simple and effective means of dramatically reducing the ignition propensity of cigarettes," wrote Simon Chapman, a professor of public health at the University Sydney, in a 2004 Australian medical journal."
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,3540489,00.html

But what those particular "burning agents" are I have no idea.

Rose

Anonymous said...

Dear Mr Leg-iron

“Every time a smoker derides vapers, the Dreadful Arnott hugs herself (well, nobody else will).”

And if another aspect of smoking is banned perhaps she’ll wet herself (well, no one else will).

You don’t think she does it for the money do you?

http://www.ash.org.uk/about-ash/ash-publications/accounts

Highest paid employee (who could that be?) for 2007/8/9 earned between £60k and £70k. Her (or his) employer’s pension contributions were £3,600, £3,600 and £4,141 respectively. If this was at the rate of 6%, the salary would be £60k for 07 & 08 and a little over £69k for 09.

Be interesting to read this year’s accounts.

DP

Anonymous said...

"Over at Ash – Action On Smoking and Health – Ogden's opposite number is Deborah Arnott.

She was fond of the occasional cigarette until 2003, when she decided to leave a job in TV production and devote her working life to the anti-smoking struggle.

"I smoked Silk Cut," she says, "which probably shows my age."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2010/feb/03/smokers-ban-backlash

Rose

westcoast2 said...

Good blog LI. Having attempted to bridge the vaper/smoker gap for over two years now, it nice to see a piece on peace.

I think the anti metality is more prevelent in the US than the UK. They have been subjected to out and out propaganda from the alaphabet soup gang for much longer.

Still vapers are finding out the hard way that ASH et al are not thier freinds.

The argument put to me was one of freedom. By chooosing to vape, I was doing so on the back of the freedom of smokers. It was anti-choice as 'they' wanted to coerce smokers onto medicinal nicotine. By vaping I was supporting that.

My argument has always been about choice. I suggest the anti-smoking groups are the people to take on for both groups. These are the people denying choice. At first vapers did not appreciate this, though with the MHRA consultation result due and the NJoy/FDA case it is becoming more obvious. When NY included e-cigs in their indoor ban, vapers started to wake up.

The other group not often mentioned is Snus users. This is banned in the EU. There is no SHS, so why the objections?

Anyways if your into getting some new gear - TECC have a sale (50% off!), most recommended is the Tornado which takes 501 attys. (No association just a customer)

Also for general info the UKVapers (UKVapers.com) forum is helpful.

I certainly hope all pro-choice groups can move forward together to bring back choice and common sense.

Anonymous said...

Over here in Canada the government dictated that all readymade cigarettes had to be "Firesafe". This rule came in about 3 years ago and was implemented by manufacturers using thin circular burn-resistant rings embedded at intervals along the length of the cigarette. This regulatory move was probably designed to irritate both the tobacco industry and smokers more than anything else. Smokers now have to draw on the cigarette more frequently in order to avoid it going out, hardly a health related measure !

As we already know, most antismoking regulations emanate from "Self-obsessed" California and then spread to places like Canada before reaching the UK some years later. Where I live, we already have the display bans and more recently the ban on smoking in cars with minors. It is also currently illegal to import Ecigs into Canada, although I have no problems purchasing ecigs online as there are many Canadian inhabitants with strong connections to China.

I just purchased a new ecig starter kit from this place

http://www.greenhouseone.com/

It is called the Joye eGo Starter Kit and is currently priced at $49.99 USD.

This outfit ships anywhere worldwide and I took delivery of my order a couple of weeks ago. Lots of other vendors also sell these things.

The reason I bring this up is that I am quite pleased with the improvements made in this product compared to my old DSE-901 ecig. Although the new "eGo" device doesn't change the taste experience (which is the main reason I will not give up smoking real cigarettes), it does have some big plus points.

1. The battery life is phenomenal, easily lasting for several days of occasional vaping. For full time vapers this will probably translate into a whole day of continued moderate to heavy vaping. A battery charge takes less than half an hour with the eGo which is orders of magnitude faster than my older DSE-901.

2. Vapour production is much better than on my older egig.

3. Form factor of the eGo is much better than my older device. The eGo can be stood up on its end which is strangely very convenient and most appreciated by me.

I'm not trying to advertise or push these things in any way. I just appreciate this great blog and why not let others know about what I think is a better ecig.

Leggy... Thanks for continuing the fantastic blogging efforts. very much appreciated by yours truly.

Expat Brit living in Canada

Anonymous said...

Over here in Canada the government dictated that all readymade cigarettes had to be "Firesafe". This rule came in about 3 years ago and was implemented by manufacturers using thin circular burn-resistant rings embedded at intervals along the length of the cigarette. This regulatory move was probably designed to irritate both the tobacco industry and smokers more than anything else. Smokers now have to draw on the cigarette more frequently in order to avoid it going out, hardly a health related measure !

As we already know, most antismoking regulations emanate from "Self-obsessed" California and then spread to places like Canada before reaching the UK some years later. Where I live, we already have the display bans and more recently the ban on smoking in cars with minors. It is also currently illegal to import Ecigs into Canada, although I have no problems purchasing ecigs online as there are many Canadian inhabitants with strong connections to China.

I just purchased a new ecig starter kit from this place

http://www.greenhouseone.com/

It is called the Joye eGo Starter Kit and is currently priced at $49.99 USD.

This outfit ships anywhere worldwide and I took delivery of my order a couple of weeks ago. Lots of other vendors also sell these things.

The reason I bring this up is that I am quite pleased with the improvements made in this product compared to my old DSE-901 ecig. Although the new "eGo" device doesn't change the taste experience (which is the main reason I will not give up smoking real cigarettes), it does have some big plus points.

1. The battery life is phenomenal, easily lasting for several days of occasional vaping. For full time vapers this will probably translate into a whole day of continued moderate to heavy vaping. A battery charge takes less than half an hour with the eGo which is orders of magnitude faster than my older DSE-901.

2. Vapour production is much better than on my older egig.

3. Form factor of the eGo is much better than my older device. The eGo can be stood up on its end which is strangely very convenient and most appreciated by me.

I'm not trying to advertise or push these things in any way. I just appreciate this great blog and why not let others know about what I think is a better ecig.

Leggy... Thanks for continuing the fantastic blogging efforts. very much appreciated by yours truly.

Expat Brit living in Canada

Anonymous said...

Over here in Canada the government dictated that all readymade cigarettes had to be "Firesafe". This rule came in about 3 years ago and was implemented by manufacturers using thin circular burn-resistant rings embedded at intervals along the length of the cigarette. This regulatory move was probably designed to irritate both the tobacco industry and smokers more than anything else. Smokers now have to draw on the cigarette more frequently in order to avoid it going out, hardly a health related measure !

As we already know, most antismoking regulations emanate from "Self-obsessed" California and then spread to places like Canada before reaching the UK some years later. Where I live, we already have the display bans and more recently the ban on smoking in cars with minors. It is also currently illegal to import Ecigs into Canada, although I have no problems purchasing ecigs online as there are many Canadian inhabitants with strong connections to China.

Apparently my comment is too large, so I am splitting it into two parts at this point.

Expat Brit living in Canada

Anonymous said...

Apologies for the multiple postings above. Each time I was informed that my posting attempt had failed when it clearly had not...

The marvels of screwed up software never cease to amaze.....

Expat Brit living in Canada

salegamine said...

Does anyone know how I can get one of those eFags in Switzerland?

I'd really love one.

tsange said...

Answer to salegamine:

here are two swiss shops:
http://www.dunjis-shop.ch/
http://www.e-cigarette-shop.ch/

for more information
french forum: http://www.forum-ecigarette.com/
german forum: http://www.e-rauchen-forum.de/
english forum: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/

john o'connell said...

Re: smoking funding and tax: Well gee, we pay for the entire NHS and then some, and the main burden on THAT is drunks. Alcohol has always been a far bigger curse than tobacco on our culture, and yet it's so socially acceptable.

Vapers Network said...

Great post LI, thanks.

I agree that we need to try to look after each other, it's the intolerant who are the problem.

timbone said...

I tried the ecig. There were a few problems for me. Too damn fiddly, it was like a mobile phone or a laptop, charging batteries, when do you need a new cartridge for the nicotine, not knowing where they were banned (certain airlines for example). I wouldn't take it out anyway, too much hassle. They look too much like cigarettes. As for getting juices far too bloody complcated.

Now I like being creative, and enjoy rolling my own. I might smoke ready mades now and again, usually when I am abroad, only because I feel lazy. DOn't like them much, full of shite.

To be honest, I don't take fags out with me much anymore, I get fed up trying to find somewhere to have a quick drag. As for flying, totally trapped. Gum and puffer does me in those situations.

To recap. Tried the ecig. Great idea. Wish it worked for me. Too damn complicated.

timbone said...

PS - sometimes when I inhaled the vapour ir feckin hurt

Leg-iron said...

Expat Brit living in Canada, eh? -

The comment thing does that to me all the time. I've never worked out why.

Timbone - Electrofag isn't for everyone, just as smoking isn't for everyone and even among smokers, some can't stand cigars or be bothered with rolling. It's all personal preference. If you talk to Electrosmokers you'll hear 'this brand is better than that brand' just as you do with smokers.

Some smokers won't like it at all, some will switch entirely and some (like me) will use both.

One man's fragrant smoke is another man's horrible stench. Thus it has always been and always will be. The only difference now is that we face a common enemy.

Those who can't see that are doomed. There's no time left to persuade them, they can only be regarded as enemy too. Their choice. The side they chose will stab them in the back but we don't have the time left to persuade them.

Oh, and the first puff with a new cartridge can be a hell of a blast if you're not expecting it. I change them when the taste goes, before the vapour runs out, and then take great care with the first few puffs.

Yes, if there are antismokers reading, taste. Smoking is not what you pretend it to be.

Leg-iron said...

If Vaper's Forum call by, here's something to consider.

It is true that nicotine is not niacin. Niacin (Nicotinic acid with the scientific sounding '-in' suffix) is formed by oxidation of nicotine.

Either by enzymes in saliva or by, oh, let's see... heating it in the presence of air.

You're worried about 'making false claims'. Very commendable, but your opponents are not. They claim you will give a bystander cancer on the basis of nicotine in steam when nicotine has never been shown to have any ill effects at all.

Linking it to vitamin B3 is far less of a 'false claim' than third hand smoke. Far, far less.

Leg-iron said...

John O'connell - it's certainly true in this part of the country. I have had occasion to turn up at casualty in the distant past and I was the only sober one in there (I wasn't certain about the doctors, I was busy bleeding at the time).

There were no tobacco overdoses in the queue as far as I could tell.

Still, the drink price escalator has begun.

Soon, salt, fat, and breathing.

Leg-iron said...

Someone, on an electrosmoker blog post I've lost, commented with derisory glee that if you soak a cigarette in water overnight you get an insecticide you can spray on plants. It's poison, they cry, cigarettes are poison, stick with Electrofag.

Yes, if you soak tobacco in water overnight you extract a water-soluble natural insecticide.

It's called nicotine, you moron.

And if you let a dog eat a big bar of Dairy Milk it'll be dead in the morning. All you'll get is loose bowels and zits.

Some birds can eat wasps. Hedgehogs can eat slugs. So it's okay for you to eat those too? Have fun.

There is a thing in biology called 'species'. There is a thing above that galled 'genus' and we are in a different one to dogs and hedgehogs.

Above that there are 'kingdoms'

We are not remotely related to insects. Flies eat rotting shit and love it. That would kill me. Nicotine kills insects.

It has killed no human, ever.

It is as dangerous as caffeine and there is no Red Fag equivalent of Red Bull you could overdose with.

Unless you buy those patches 'for your health'.

It does work as an insecticide. I smoke in my greenhouse every day and put the ends in the compost.

No insect problems here.

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